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| Windoor 9/8/2011 6:32:41 PM | For those of you who have been around a while. Do you know the difference between Version 4 HDW data and Version 3, or what ever came before? I am about ready to purchase the year 2010 for historical data, but Ron tells be there is a difference in the data starting in June 2010. Version four is different? I know about the Foaling age and can work around that. I know about the changing Speed numbers with all HDW data, and this is still a real concern as I have the ability to look back Six races and use these numbers for a few of by spot plays. If the numbers change when the horse runs again, it will change the result here. Still, as a subscriber, I would want the source of the data to match as closely as possible for the research. Or should I just bite the bullet and order two years of Brisnet data? Regards, Windoor.
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| jeff 9/9/2011 11:22:16 AM | Starting here, in the Enhanced Settings Module Help Doc, you'll find the following: --quote: "Settings--end quote Link: http://www.jcapper.com/helpDocs/EnhancedSettingsModule.htm More to come.... -jp .
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| jeff 9/9/2011 12:27:24 PM | Expanding on the above quote from the Help Doc... As the program's author - and as a successful bettor whose annual churn is not insignificant - I am completely satisfied with both the quality and format of the data HDW is inserting into the HDW JCapper V4 files. I consider the V4 file format as "final" and haven't asked HDW for any format changes in more than a year. With HDW as an option, you could not pay me to go back to using Brisnet - harsh statement but true. Getting to this point has been an evolutionary journey. Very early on in the process, HDW presented me with a list of available data items generated by Equibase as well as custom data items generated by HDW. They also indicated which items were being used by the other software vendors. From that, they asked me to provide them a list of data items I wanted inserted into files they would be generating for the JCapper user community. Using the Brisnet .drf single format file structure as a guide, in the fall of 2009, I gave them my initial request list - and they began work in earnest towards making HDW JCapper data files a reality. One of the things I demanded up front was a significant amount of back data so that I could subject JCapper factors generated off of HDW data to hard database testing. I explained to them that every JCapper customer has the ability to build and query databases - and SEE both the win rate and roi for not just individual factors, but combinations of factors stored as UDMs. I explained to them: For that reason, data generated by HDW is going to have to stand up to scrutiny - otherwise none of my customers are going to use it. HDW came through - and produced back "beta" JCapper data files - in the exact format that I had requested it - for calendar year 2008. This data was made available to a small beta group from the JCapper user community. Many pairs of eyes are better than a single pair of eyes. The beta testing group saw things that I didn't (at first) see. Based on feedback from the beta testing group, I approached HDW and asked that a handful of changes be made. To my complete surprise (unlike past experience with TSN and Brisnet) Ron Tiller at HDW made all of the requested changes - both enthusiastically and in a timely manner. This process - me requesting data items be inserted into JCapper files - and Ron making it happen - established a pattern... And although this pattern was extremely valuable to me as a program author, it was one I knew better than to take advantage of. more to come... -jp . ~Edited by: jeff on: 9/9/2011 at: 12:27:24 PM~
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| jeff 9/9/2011 12:36:29 PM | On March 01, 2010 the project went live and HDW began offering JCapper data files. Defining the data files offered on the project go live date in terms of either V3 or V4 as talked about in the above quote from the Help Doc: Data Files offered as of the "go live" date are V3 files. But the evolutionary process didn't end there. Over the next four months I hit Ron Tiller at HDW with a number of data add requests. And to his credit, he made every single one of them a reality. Fast forward to July 01, 2010... This is the date that the V4 files were first made available to the JCapper user community. From this date forward I have been completely satisfied with the data items and file format that HDW has been inserting into our files. -jp .
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| jeff 9/9/2011 1:06:36 PM | That's a detailed description of the evolutionary process. I felt it was important to get that posted so that others can make sense of it going forward. Now, answers to specific questions: Q. What's in the V4 file that's not in the V3 file? Here's the list - and there are only two items: Stat Categories for Riders and Trainers: The V4 file contains stats for riders and trainers in a format where the user can define them in the Enhanced Settings Module. The options are: last 365 days, current year, previous year, and last 90 days. In addition, the file contains rider trainer stats for the current track. This means that the rider trainer stats inserted into .JCP files at file build time are customizable by the user. The JCapper customer who wants to see rider trainer stats on his or her JCapper past performances can mix and match from among the above categories. The JCapper customer who does this can also experiment a little (to get an idea of what works best) because the mix of rider trainer stats inserted into .JCP files affects the CXN Rating. Hint: The JCapper customer so inclined can copy raw HDW files to a new target folder or machine, rebuild .JCP files, rebuild databases, and note how any differences impact his or her UDMs. Hint: The JCapper user downloading both sets of files (V3 and V4) and do side by side comparisons between the two file types to see how differences between the two file tpes impact his or her UDMs and track profiles, etc. Late Pace Figs and Late Pace Pars The late pace figs and pars inserted into V4 files are different than those inserted into V3 files. In my opinion, the V4 late pace fig represents an improvement over those found in the V3 file. That said, I happen to know quite a few players in the JCapper user community who have told me they won't even consider switching because they are more than satisfied with results obtained to date using V3 files. -jp .
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| jeff 9/10/2011 11:26:02 AM | More specifics... Expanding on the key differences between V3 and V4 files: 1. Stat categories for riders and trainers --V4 file has more options. 2. Late Pace Figs and Pars --V4 file has (program author's opinion) an improved late pace fig. --User settings in the Enhanced Settings Module control the type of late pace fig and rider trainer stat categories inserted into your .JCP files. So that you can see what I am doing (please excuse my crude attempt at using a mouse to draw red circles around the specific settings being discussed) here is a screenshot of my Enhanced Settings Module: http://www.jcapper.com/MessageBoard/Avatars/enhancedsettings04302011.jpg Specific settings and how they control what you the user are inserting into your .JCP files at file build time: The HDW Downloaded File Version setting controls the type of file you are downloading (either V3 or V4.) --Downloading V4 files gets you access to the V4 data items that have been discussed above. The JCP File Build Mode settings controls the way the file build routine in the HDW File Mgr processes the files that you download. Behavior at file build time based on JCP File Build Mode setting in the Enhanced Settings Module: Handling of V3 files at file build time: Downloading V3 files does not give you access to the V4 data items discussed above. The file build routine in the HDW File Mgr is programmed to process (the older) V3 files in the following manner: Setting the JCP File Build Mode setting in the Enhanced Settings Module to: "1 Build as JCP Silver File" causes the older V3 late pace figs to be inserted into your .jcp files. Setting the JCP File Build Mode setting in the Enhanced Settings Module to: "0 Build as JCP Platinum File" causes the older V3 late pace figs to be inserted into your .jcp files. Handling of V4 files at file build time: Downloading V4 files does give you access to the newer V4 data items discussed above. The file build routine in the HDW File Mgr is programmed to process V4 files in the following manner: Setting the JCP File Build Mode setting in the Enhanced Settings Module to: "1 Build as JCP Silver File" causes the newer V4 late pace figs to be inserted into your .jcp files. Setting the JCP File Build Mode setting in the Enhanced Settings Module to: "0 Build as JCP Platinum File" causes the older V3 late pace figs to be inserted into your .jcp files. Q. Which settings should I use? A. File type and rider trainer stat categories selected by the user in the Enhanced Settings module control availability of and handling of the (newer) V4 data items inserted (or not inserted) into .JCP files. This in turn affects JCapper factors and the user's UDMs based on data inserted into JCP files. There is no one size fits all right answer here to question such as "Which settings are best?" Player A who follows (for example) NYRA only might discover improved results with settings A and B. While Player B who primarily follows (for example) MNR-CTX-PEN-PID might well discover that settings C and D consistently produce better results. Player C who bets races any and all tracks and/or class levels and who uses completely different methodology from players A and B might well land on settings X and Y as best. The correct answer to the question of "What settings work best?" in my opinion is to research different scenarios in the Data Window and make an informed decision based on your own R&D. Sorry for being so long winded, but I wanted my posts in this thread to cover the topic in a way that provides a thorough answer to the questions raised. -jp . ~Edited by: jeff on: 9/10/2011 at: 11:26:02 AM~
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| Windoor 9/9/2011 1:58:10 PM | Jeff, Thanks for the detailed explanation. After reading it twice, I think I understand enough to make these statements. Please correct me if I am wrong. If I ordered the year 2010 from Ron, I would only be able to access 6 months of the data as I am using the Silver program. If I wanted to see results for the 1st half of the year 2010 with my UDM’s, I would have to upgrade to the “Platinum” software. Access Ver.3 data? Even with that, there is a possibility (probability?) than my UDM’s would not return accurate results for the 1st half of 2010 as the data has changed. True? I’ll have to read the differences between the software versions again to see if I can benefit from the upgrade other than to see an additional six months of data. As a spot/angle type of player the speed and pace numbers do not hold as much value to me as they may for others. Does the Platinum program have a filter for a specific or range of claiming tags? That would make the decision a lot easier as I have an immediate need for such a thing. My work around is both clumsy and time consuming. Regards, Windoor.
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| jeff 9/9/2011 2:33:13 PM |
No. You would be absolutely able to access all of the data you ordered using JCapper Silver. However, the months of Jan, Feb, Mar, Apr, May, and the first 3 weeks of June 2010 would be V3 files - and the Silver program (no matter what settings you have persisted in the Enhanced Settings Module) will produce slightly different ratings... CXNRating, CompoundLate, SilverRating, etc. than you are used to seeing processing V4 files. The last week of June 2010 and everything thereafter would be V4 data - and the Silver program will process that in an manner identical to that in your exisitng databases. If I were you, and if I decided to order HDW data for all of 2010, here's what I would do: I would put data for the months of Jan, Feb, Mar, Apr, May, and the first 3 weeks of June 2010 onto its own target folder - and then I would build a database from scratch on that folder. I would put everything from June 22, 2010 going forward onto its own target folder and rebuild from scratch. I would then analyze the results from both folders knowing that I was looking at two very similar (yet slightly different) data sets. Keep in mind that I still do look at lots of older V3 data processed in the Platinum program. Even though that older data is processed in a different way than my current databases are, I am still able to learn (plenty) simply by looking at it... Which surfaces/distances were speed favoring and/or speed tiring? Which riders/trainers were good and bad at different things? How did UDMs not overly emphasizing late pace or CXN Rating perform when run against that older data set? Which sires/dams, dominated stakes races at circuits that I follow? What trends in public betting behavior am I able to spot? Which specific trends were just beginning to materialize (on their upward slope) and which were winding down? -jp . ~Edited by: jeff on: 9/9/2011 at: 2:33:13 PM~
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| jeff 9/9/2011 2:36:25 PM | --quote: "Does the Platinum program have a filter for a specific or range of claiming tags? That would make the decision a lot easier as I have an immediate need for such a thing. My work around is both clumsy and time consuming."--end quote As indicated in the other thread, both the Silver and Platinum programs are going to have that shortly - eta is sometime next week. -jp .
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